Narcomundo Episode 65 — El Mencho's Stepson Is a Priority U.S. Target; César Gastélum Killed
English transcript
Welcome to another episode of Narcomundo, the podcast. Thank you for tuning in. Excuse the background noise, but we're quite busy this time. We're doing different coverages. And well, here we are, my dear Jesus. Let's give each other a big hug. Thank you for being here for this new episode of our podcast, now with very relevant news again from the Jalisco New Generation Cartel. So that they don't tell us that Sinaloa, Sinaloa, Sinaloa, now it's going to be all Jalisco, Jalisco, Jalisco.
It's right. My dear José Luis, I send you a
big hug and I'm very happy to be here in this space, precisely to start reviewing these topics because this narco-soap opera that we have to live through in this country is getting very interesting, José Luis, where every day one never tires of being surprised by something new. You're barely surprised when you already have something else on top of you. And well, now you're going to talk about what this topic is about. But before we begin, I want to invite the audience because I'm really devouring a great book.
I started reading
a book these days, José Luis, and I 'm sure you know which book I'm talking about. I'm talking about the day Mencho fell, which is a very tasty, very smooth chronicle, José Luis, in this book that you know what I'm talking about, he takes you by the hand because to put you in the intricate world of the relationships of the criminals. So before we begin, José Luis, I want to thank you for this amazing book you've written, which, as I say, is a book that was long overdue for the audience.
We needed someone to come in and explain exactly who the big shot was, from side to side. In other words , this is how I'm reading it, and I 'm taking it slowly because I 'm enjoying it. Ultimately, it's a biography, it's the story of Nemesio Ceguera's own life from when he was born, from what's more, from when José Luis began to set foot on the plains beyond those of the Tierracaliente region to tell these stories, because that's what's important about this book and I say it to you, dear audience,
the important thing about this book is an incisive narrative. The journalist is not the ubiquitous man who is investigating on the screen. Searching through archives, through files, is not the journalist who goes to the countryside, who goes and opens up precisely along the paths, along the dusty trails that Mencho traveled in order to understand Mencho's personality. I don't want to go on too long because this isn't a book presentation. I hope that later on , José Luis, if you allow me during the week, you will give me the opportunity to
talk with you in this space so that people can understand a little more about this book, about what reading this book has caused me, because it reminds me of something like an ABC of drug trafficking. You cannot understand drug trafficking if you do n't read this book because it is a very specific way of guiding the reader by the hand. And with that I want to begin this space, José Luis, to thank you precisely for that topic which, I insist, was already very urgent and which is still fresh because it
just arrived a few days ago and well, I'm already here burning it little by little. We're working on the text and well , I just wanted to thank you for this opportunity to talk to you in this space, my dear brother. Hey, no, man, with that presentation I don't even want to go to the line anymore. Yeah, [laughs] with that difference, you know the admiration is mutual. And when I asked you to write the prologue for my book, I never thought that you would have such, I mean, such ease, such
delicacy, such, well, this very eloquent detail, if you'll pardon the redundancy, of making my journalistic career seem almost comparable to yours, right? I mean, uh, thank you for the compliments, thank you for the professionalism. And well, this text that you refer to, about the day Mencho fell, is a new book that is already circulating, it's in bookstores, in physical format, in digital format, in audiobook. You can find it in all bookstores in Mexico, you can find it in Central America, in the United States, you can order it from Amazon.
The
truth is that the Planeta team did a great job with the layout, and well, the prologue is none other than by my colleague, brother, friend, and mentor Jess Lemus. And truly thank you, my dear, for so many years of friendship and above all for so many years of knowledge, and this knowledge that you have n't charged me for, that is free, and I already owe you a good amount of money for everything I've learned from you, man.
Don't even tell me, no, the truth is that you really do have to
insist with people. Look, I believe that what the audience has, and right now we 're talking about the rights of the audience, is the right to reliable sources of information. That is the highest right that the audiences have, and we cannot fail the audience. And so I think that to understand drug trafficking you have to read precisely this, because the pretext is Nemesio. The pretext is to tell the story of Nemesio Seguera, how he was, but the truth is that it takes you down an intricate path where suddenly you are
reading, oh, wait for me, wait for me, wait for me. What does Armando Valencia have to do with El Mencho? No, what do those people over there have to do with it? Those from Chihuahua with Mencho, those from the Gulf with Mencho? In other words, it's a very concise book because with the urgency of these times we also have to read quickly, and I think it leaves great lessons. After that, José Luis, I am very grateful to you for this book, truly, this book that I feel is the book that
I didn't write myself. So, yes, I love it, I really love it, uh, I love it because you also touch on a very important topic, which is the Jalisco New Generation Cartel, and listen , pay attention to what I'm going to tell you. I think we already know that the Jalisco New Generation Cartel is the dominant cartel at the national level, but I have no doubt that it's the cartel we'll continue to talk about throughout this six-year term.
While it's true that the Sinaloa Cartel positioned itself well under Felipe Calderón's
government, and then there was a sort of interim period under Peña Nieto's government, it's positioning itself again under Andrés Manuel López Obrador's government, and I think with Claudia Sheinbaum, the Jalisco New Generation Cartel is the cartel that will take over. It's not for nothing, and I'm going to get ahead of myself, José Luis, it's not for nothing, the American government is launching a global reward of almost 100 million dollars, more than the drug trafficking structures of the Jalisco New Generation cartel.
Because? And that's what I want us to review right
now, together with José Luis, about what the Jalisco New Generation cartel has, which is already attracting a lot of attention. with the American government. And why before, José Luis, why didn't Mencho attract so much attention before? What changed between the death and the arrival of this other young man to the leadership of the cartel? Wow, what a great question, and it's great that you brought that up to lead into today's episode. Just a few days ago, we were recording on Friday the 7th, and two days ago, on Wednesday the 5th,
the DEA announced new charges and rewards for the capture and conviction of these high-ranking leaders of the Jalisco New Generation Cartel. They said, "For Juan Carlos Valencia González, alias '03,' I'm asking for 25 million. For Audías Flores Silva, 'the gardener,' 15 million. For Gonzalo Medosa Gaitán, 'El Sapo,' 15 million. For Julio Alberto Castillo Rodríguez, whom we talked about here, remember? 15,000 for the cards, for the signature, and for the double R$, 10,000,000 each. And for an operator, Griselda Margarita Redondo Pinzón, 2,000.
And then a very pertinent question that also led
me to the topic of the book , the day 'El Mencho' fell..." Uh, exactly that, the generational shift. What changed the day El Mencho was killed? What happened? Was the organization blown up? Was the structure fragmented? Yes, what happened and is happening in Sinaloa happened, as you mentioned, there's been a fratricidal war since September 9, 2014. Why did this Jalisco cartel structure never break down? There wasn't a violent transition. In other words, there are a lot of questions in the air, and I think the answer is that, right?
Uh, Juan
Carlos Valencia González's leadership remains the quintessential leadership because each of the networks that comprise the Jalisco cartel has nodal networks, territorial autonomy, and economic self-sufficiency. That is to say, this cartel is unique because, unlike what you have studied very well, and which I mention in the book, and I obviously give you credit for, is the triumvirate of Miguel Ángel Félix. Hallardo, Ernesto Fonseca, and Rafa Caro of the Guadalajara Cartel, and later the Sinaloa Cartel. They consolidated power as much as possible, and now with the Jalisco Cartel, they understood that economic
independence, coupled with diversification in their crimes, would allow them to simply change management, redirect the organization's course when one of the leaders was gone, so they could continue generating adequate income. That's what caught my attention. Why is Juan Carlos Valencia taking over everything? Well, to begin with, we have to remember his history. He's the son of Rosalinda González Valencia, the son of Armando Valencia Cornelio "El Maradona," the nephew of Abigael González Valencia, and the stepfather of Rubeno Ceguera Cervantes "El Mencho." In other words, he has the criminal knowledge, the payroll
knowledge, the financial structure, the entire operational command, and also the entire network of corruption within the government. and business. He knows the chemical routes of drug trafficking for the arrival of chemical precursors, and that is to say, all the know-how, as they say in the United States, all the knowledge to make this cartel something unprecedented, a cartel with a presence in 32 of the 32 states and a presence in 40 countries. That's why there's a $25 million bounty on his head.
I mean, they even seemed noble, didn't they? The Americans.
This guy knows a lot about Mexican drug trafficking, and also, José Luis, I think we 've discussed this at some point, you and I, that Rosalinda's son, the one who's now in charge of the Jalisco cartel, Juan Carlos Valencia, is breaking a historical record in terms of rewards from the U.S. government. Not even Mayo Zambada had that kind of reward. Exactly. Not Mayo Zambada, nor Rafael Caro. Rafael Caro reached $20 million, and if I remember correctly, Mayo Zambada himself reached to $15 million when he was wanted.
Outside of that, no
one had ever had a $25 million bounty on their head , as is precisely the case with Juan Carlos Valencia. And adding, José Luis, because you put it so perfectly, how the Jalisco cartel evolved with this new leadership, because we must remember, Nemesio had the Jalisco cartel within a cartel structure, within the framework of a cartel. What is a cartel? A cartel is when various business groups come together, primarily to maintain control of a market in terms of prices or supplies, services or products.
That is a cartel. That was Rafael
Caro Quintero's idea in the beginning, in 1982 when the Guadalajara cartel was born. And it's the model that all cartels have followed , which is why they remain cartels, because they manage to maintain control over their markets. A dominance through violence, of course, where they control prices and maintain services and supplies. I think Juan Carlos, and That's how far Nemesio Ceguera had come to see it. If I'm not mistaken, and we have to see it that way now, Juan Carlos is evolving the Jalisco New Generation Cartel into a business model—I
would call it a kind of holding company , a kind of conglomerate—where it's no longer just one company that handles the supply, services, or products in the market. It's a series of companies attached to that one company. That's why, José Luis, you and I have said it here, and we're the only ones who have said it specifically, that the Jalisco New Generation Cartel, unlike other cartels, doesn't maintain a hierarchical, descending line like all the other cartels do.
Instead, the Jalisco Cartel sustains itself through the sale of franchises, each of which
represents a company, and so it's a holding company, a group of companies that leads precisely to a term that's very fashionable these days: nerf shoring. Excuse my Michoacán-accented English, José Luis, but this nerf shoring, which is precisely about getting the product as close as possible to where the demand is, well, ultimately that's what makes the Jalisco New Generation Cartel such a dangerous criminal model for the stability of nations today. Why? Because if there's demand, for example, if there's demand for amphetamines, beta-hamphetamines, or fentanyl in South Africa, the Jalisco New Generation
Cartel isn't waiting to transport the shipments from Colima or Jalisco to South Africa. They already have labs in South Africa. That's why we've seen, José Luis, the seizure of labs in South Africa, Mexicans arrested in South Africa, and by the way, people don't want to finance a trip to have a go. Hey , at least to Africa, José Luis, wow, that's what's happening there . They're no longer transporting cocaine or amphetamine shipments. They're coming from Mexico.
They brought their flasks, their pressure cookers, their burners, they set up their camps, and
they're producing the drugs right where they're needed. What do you think is happening in the United States? Why is the United States concerned? Because fentanyl, yes, the president says, has decreased in traffic. Yes, but you saw how many flasks are crossing, how many pressure cookers, how many gas tanks they're taking across the border. Of course, they're establishing—and I say this in a simile , José Luis—but in reality, synthetic drug labs run by the Jalisco New Generation Cartel are proliferating in the United States.
And that's precisely what's worrying the U.S. government,
because Nemesio, in the old style, was the drug trafficker who manufactured his own drugs, brought them from Colombia, they processed them here, washed them, and added... They used to sell drugs and other drugs, and send them to the United States. Not anymore. Now everything is being processed in labs in the United States, and that's what really worries the U.S. government. The United States isn't going to hunt them down, listen to what I'm about to tell you.
The United States isn't going to hunt down a lab in Nevada, another in California,
in Arcanza, I don't know, they're not going to hunt them down. The United States is going after the leaders. That's why the rewards are so high, the rewards they're offering, the very high price they're offering for the capture of the top leaders of the Jalisco New Generation Cartel. I'm just reminding you of that. José Luis and I are saying this here. We're telling you this so you won't be surprised later when many people start saying what we're telling you.
You know how these bureaucrats are swarming around. You say that suddenly,
well, I said it first with my high-level sources, from the KGB, the DEA, the KGB It's not even relevant, but they come up with all sorts of crazy things [laughs], that 's right, José Luis. So, that's the concern I see the U.S. government has regarding the Jalisco New Generation Cartel. And to this we must add that this criminal holding company that the Jalisco New Generation Cartel has become is, ultimately, also a financial holding company because it doesn't just offer money laundering; it doesn't just have the means to launder its own
money, it also offers services through the Los Quinis Cartel, which has diversified considerably into various businesses. No matter which cartel you belong to, the Jalisco New Generation Cartel can launder your money without any problem. That has been precisely Juan Carlos Valencia's directive: to expand investment opportunities. They offer money laundering services ranging from building a shopping mall to creating a shell company for trafficking, I don't know, fuel. So, what this new leader of the Jalisco New Generation Cartel has proposed has been very, very diverse.
A generation for Jalisco to establish itself
as the dominant cartel. That's why we're going to see that Jalisco has gradually withdrawn from violence, I mean from the violence among themselves. It's a very united group and they continue fighting for territory with other groups, but they aren't fighting amongst themselves like in Sinaloa, the Gulf, the Northeast, or the United Cartels, where they're going at it with everything they've got. There are divisions within the group. The Jalisco cartel, with the leadership of Juan Carlos Valencia, has managed to maintain the unity and cohesion that Nemesio Ceguera established from the beginning
. That's the word I wanted us to talk about , cohesion. Without cohesion and without this combined effort—not that I'm glorifying anything, but look, we're referring to what Jesús Lemosus rightly says, that is, it's a holding company, it's a business. I was discussing this yesterday with some fellow journalists in... Monterrey, and the thing is, you and I are seeing the cartel not as a criminal organization, and to this day, the specialists, or those who boast about studying organized crime, think it's a drug cartel that simply traffics drugs, but no.
Look,
it's a transnational criminal enterprise. I mean, we're talking about a company with its bylaws, its rules, its payroll, its franchisees, its , you know? That's why the Jalisco cartel is a sui generis organization, and that's why , as we say, the weight falls on Juan Carlos Valencia, because he's a man who can offer you not only— and you say it perfectly because that's included, and the conversations we had come from much of what we've discussed in this new work, and that's exactly what it comes down to, right?—he can offer you,
what do you want? Do you want huachicol? I mean, do you want fuel smuggling? Do you want migrant smuggling? Do you want Um, I don't know, mineral extraction? I can give it to you. Do you want water? Do you want internet service? Do you want, uh, forced recruitment? Do you want military training? Do you want sophisticated weapons? I mean, holy [ __ ], excuse my language, but whatever you want is available in this network, this network that you couldn't have explained better than nearshoring.
I mean, I bring you everything you
need so you can create your own organization or supply your small cell or subversive group, and so on. And you mentioned the case of South Africa, for example, right? Or Africa, where drugs can reach you , where they can have a clandestine lab. And people say, "How do you think that?" Look, just a few days ago in Spain and France, they dismantled a Jalisco cartel network , arrested 13 people, and seized 2.5 tons of methamphetamine hidden in this vanilla-scented liquid from Mexico.
Let's see, we mentioned it here In the last
episode, the tactics of the Sinaloa Cartel and Amado Carrillo Fuentes of the Juárez Cartel were shown: transporting drugs in household appliances, through cans of chili peppers, in plastic bananas, and now dissolved in liquid vanilla flavoring from Mexico. I mean, how much has the sophistication of crime changed that they can now carry out these kinds of creative covert operations, let's call them that? So, I find it fascinating that now the DEA—and I'd like to provoke you, because I love to provoke you, [laughs] because I also see different scenarios here, and I'm
sure you can support this hypothesis because in the end nothing is set in stone—but I mean, with these rewards totaling more than 100 million dollars, what is the United States government betting on? And I was saying this in some interviews yesterday, look, they're betting on the internal fragmentation of the cartel itself, which it hasn't yet experienced. That is to say, that the very leadership of you You're worth 10, you're worth 15, you're worth 25. There could be a fracture within this organization so that someone wants to assume leadership, or conversely,
they might want to hand Juan Carlos Valencia González over to the United States. That's one option. The second option is that these individuals wanted by the United States might decide to surrender, abdicate, and reach the United States with a lenient protection agreement that allows them to amass part of that fortune and receive a shorter prison sentence. That would be hypothesis number two. And the third, I think, well, as I already said, is simply the cartel's collapse, a betrayal, or their own surrender.
Those would be the three hypotheses I 'm proposing.
Because, let's see, why is Juan Carlos Valencia being attributed with 25 million? We already explained that, but there are also individuals like Audías Flores Silva who, despite already being captured, are still having a 15 million dollar reward offered . Mind you, they don't trust the Mexican government. Nor when it comes to handing over these kingpins. This character could slip through their fingers. I mean, you know, the reading goes beyond a simple three- or four- page statement from the DEA itself.
I think there's a dark intention, a desire for something to
happen in Mexico, and in the end, let's be clear, my dear, they don't give a damn if there's an internal war, if there are deaths, if there's violence. That's not their concern. They can fuel the war with their weapons as long as the demand for drugs remains strong for them and they satisfy that illicit market as well; it suits them. But what I see is that they're betting on these three aspects, in addition to an even greater intervention in security strategy.
They could even offer to finance the war on drugs
in Mexico and have another ruthless wave like the one we experienced during Felipe Calderón's six-year term . What a great point, José Luis, with those three hypotheses you raise about why the rewards are so high. I'm inclined to think... Of course, because of the topic. They all have a communicative purpose. Look, a goldmine, a goldmine. A goldmine. Of course, remember that the U.S. government doesn't do things arbitrarily. They wait and see the reaction in various scenarios, and of course, I don't rule out that these are the scenarios they're considering, contributing
to the internal dismantling of the Jalisco New Generation Cartel, trying to get someone to betray Juan Carlos Valencia. It's just like in the case of Rafael Caro Quintero: if you give them information, they might give you the $25 million, but you know when you'll get to enjoy it? Never. That 's the problem we're going to encounter. That's why I think it's an important call to action for the most ambitious drug traffickers, even those at the very bottom, to consider the possibility of betraying the top boss, Juan Carlos Valencia, and gaining
some benefit. However, I think the main effect the U.S. government is seeking is media attention, to establish an assessment of their level of power. Criminality is linked to the reward. In other words, I'm offering 25 million dollars because you're more of a criminal than someone for whom I'm offering 12, 5, or 2 million dollars. And in that sense, it's a clear invitation from the U.S. government for someone with a certain amount on their head to consider: "If that's what they're asking for me, I think I can negotiate." So it's also
an invitation, a visa, almost like a request: " Come, I'll give you a visa if you want, so you can come to the United States and tell me the whole story." But there's also another side effect: putting such a high amount on someone's head as a reward for their capture is also an invitation for drug traffickers in prison in the United States, those who have n't wanted to talk, those who are still maintaining their dignity, to think, "Hey, I have information about this guy, and the government is offering 25 million
dollars if he reaches a cooperation agreement with the United States." So, that's also the effect that is somehow sought to be created in the criminal minds of those who are there in the United States, thinking about the possibility of how to remember that criminals are always thinking about how they do this, how they do that, how they negotiate. They're always focused on the how, on the how. They don't think about the what, the why, the when, or the purpose.
They always think about the how. That's a typical characteristic of criminals,
they always think in that way, about the how. You and I, José Luis, normal people, I think, always think about our activities in any activity of our day, we always think about the what, the why, the where, the when, the how, in our semantic universe of everything we are going to do. But the criminal, and this is the basic characteristic of the criminal, only thinks about the how, he never thinks about the other things, because if he thought about the other answers, he would always be thinking about it and would
practically end up giving up on doing things, and when you look for the how there is no way you will give up. Yes, but well, that's entering into other dimensions, José Luis, and I always like to touch on those points because they are fundamental to understanding the minds of people who are committing crimes. But well, before I give you the floor, José Luis, let me tell you that those high reward figures that the American government has set for these individuals also have a lot of media impact in the sense that
the United States wants them; look at how big the United States needs these drug traffickers. And that also has its candy-like effect. with the Mexican justice system, because any thinking person with two brain cells in Mexico starts to think, let's see, they are offering 25 million dollars to anyone who gives information about Juan Carlos Valencia. What a criminal he is. And in Mexico, the prosecutor hasn't even opened an investigation file against Juan Carlos Valencia. They only claim he is the leader of the Jalisco cartel, but there is no arrest warrant
against him. Juan Carlos Valencia does not have an arrest warrant today, he does not have an investigation file where they say Juan Carlos Valencia is wanted in relation to this case, to these events. I think the toad has more, the toad that is related precisely to the case of Uchitlán. So the US government also has that effect . I mean, it's also about messing with the Mexican justice system and saying, "Look, I'm looking for them for up to 25 million dollars, and how much are you looking for them for, right?
Well, I don't even have an arrest warrant, right?" So it's also part of exposing this cartel, which, I insist, is the fundamental point. [sighs] I think the rewards are based on how dangerous it has become to stability. I'm not just talking about the United States, but the stability of the Americas region. Yes, because today you talk to people from Colombia, José Luis, you talk to people from Venezuela, which we do very often , you talk to people from Central America, from Honduras, from Guatemala, and everyone mentions the presence of the
Jalisco New Generation Cartel. In those regions, you talk to people from the United States, and they tell you about the Jalisco New Generation Cartel in that region. I mean, it's not the Jalisco Cartel like the Viagra Cartel, just here. Local, just here in Mexico, right? The Jalisco cartel is a global threat, and the U.S. government surely considers it as such. Hopefully, if they ever go after this cartel, this group, it will be to dismantle it, not to negotiate with them or enthrone them—excuse me, put them on a pedestal like Saint
Ovidio Guzmán. Yes, because today Ovidio Guzmán practically dictates orders to the DEA agents. José Luis, right? Yes, absolutely. I mean, and wow, how they've glorified him and given him the title of "Come in , Mr. Guzmán." They must be telling this man in prison that he shouldn't even be in prison anymore; he should be in some house under protection, just going to sign in. But look, what you're saying is very true. This character, in the end, all roads, like corruption here in Mexico , all roads lead to Andrés Manuel López
Obrador. In the world of crime, all roads lead to Juan Carlos Valencia. For example, in the case of Julio César Montero Pinzón, alias "El Tarjetas," and Carlos Andrés Rivera Varela, it's claimed that the latter is Colombian. It's not just the drug trafficking from Central and South America that reaches Mexico and then the United States, but the United States has also emphasized the timeshare fraud these individuals perpetrated in Ballarta, defrauding U.S. citizens of over $400 million. This, I insist, comes from a Machiavellian mind, a mastermind, which is precisely Juan Carlos Valencia
González. Are you referring to the case of Mendoza Gaitán, alias "El Sapo"? Well, the orders came from Rubenosera Cervantes. And now, who was in charge? Juan Carlos Valencia González. That is to say, this man in his forties was always by his stepfather's side, following orders and understanding the criminal modus operandi. He's a figure who surprises me, and frankly, very few people have approached him. The one with Ainco is precisely Julio Alberto Castillo Rodríguez, "El Chorro," as we mentioned here a few days ago, a few weeks ago.
This man was married
to Jessica Joana Oseguera González, "La Negra." And this young man, besides being the former son-in-law of "El Mencho," was first captured in June of 2015 during an army operation in Jalisco. You'll remember that event where they shot down a Kugar helicopter belonging to the Ministry of National Defense. Well, not only was he arrested, but he was arrested along with Rubén Oseguera González, "El Menchito." They were inseparable, they were super close, brothers-in-law, they were used to spending all their time together and committing these criminal acts.
Both were sent to the Altiplano
prison, my dear Jesús. I recount this in the book "The Day El Mencho Fell." And then, due to a legal action, this man was released, and then he was arrested again a second time. But guess what? They let him go again, didn't they? I mean, there's a lack of political will on the part of the authorities to arrest these men. While there is n't an arrest warrant for Juan Carlos Valencia , at one point they had Julio Alberto Castillo Rodríguez, and they knew he was Menchito's brother-in-law, and at that time,
Rubeno Ceguera's son-in-law. He committed crimes, trafficked drugs, always carried weapons, traveled in armored vehicles, carried thousands—not millions—of dollars in cash, and nobody did anything about it . I mean, back in 2015 and 2016, there was already collusion and conspiracy between the Jalisco New Generation Cartel and local authorities. That's why these names and these ominous dealings are important, because you can't understand the complicity of these individuals without the support of the government. That's why when we talk about an arch-state, when we talk about total collusion, we're talking about...
From the political,
economic, and social structures, we 're talking about characters like the gardener, the toad, the thief, the card player , the signature, the double R, the bald guy, who can move around freely because Microxus has allowed it. And now we see actions that really catch my attention, that we agree on these points about how the United States government itself is reading the riot act to Mexico, saying, "Look, you bastard, if I'm looking for this guy for 25 million and you don't even have an arrest warrant against him, well, get to work,
buddy, right?" In fact, one of them, we have to remember, the card player, was one of those who almost assassinated the Secretary of Security, Omar García Harfus, in 2020, right? I mean, he's accused of participating in the attack in Lomas de Chapultepec. So, look, they're even giving him a wink in a press conference given by the director. DEA agent Teran Schol told him, "Hey, and one of these guys, remember, almost killed Secretary Harf?" So what is he trying to say?
It is only through media pressure, as you say, and with
reports as extensive as this one, that the Mexican government starts to work. To this day we have not heard the president of Mexico, Claudia Sheinbaum, speak or pronounce the name of Juan Carlos Valencia, Julio Alberto Castillo, or Gonzalo Mendoza Gaitán. The president has not hesitated, she has not stopped talking about this case. I think that's the other part. He is letting the Cedena, Harfus, the Navy, and the National Guard operate, but I don't think he even understands the issue of the president's security .
I don't think he's even interested. He
is letting the heads of these departments act. and she's more concerned about next year's elections. I don't feel that it's among his priorities, because now he's surely going to justify himself by saying, "I didn't say it during the campaign," unlike what he'll say about fracking: "I didn't say, I didn't say during the campaign that I was going to protect the people of Mexico on the issue of security, right?" So I think there's also a pretty strong area of opportunity there that she could enter if she wanted to , but I
don't think she will. I don't think he will. She's appealing a lot to her status as a woman, saying she cares about people, life, family, elections, especially in domestic politics, which is very valid, but I think that also in this need she has to redeem herself, right?, the government itself in this security crisis, it's necessary to attack these leaders. I don't think he will. Do you think any heads will roll, I think I'm Jesus, during this six-year term of these characters?
No, no, of course not, José Luis, because we are
starting from a very basic principle. The Jalisco New Generation cartel would be the new ally of the fourth transformation. Let's remember that their old allies, the Sinaloa cartel, are practically in retreat. Almost all of them are no longer active. Those who might be active are the Chapos and the Mayos. Mallito Flaco and the Chapos Iván Alfredo Jesús Chivaldo are the ones in the fight and they are more concerned with the survival of the war than with making relations with the government.
The government lost a great ally. The government of Claudia
Chemon's "transformation quota" lost, of course, any possibility of continuing to do business with the Sinaloa cartel for the simple fact that they were caught red-handed, they were practically caught in the act, and that relationship ended. They cannot return to that point. That's why the Fourth Transformation turned its attention to the Jalisco New Generation Cartel, and that's why the Jalisco Cartel began to grow nationally, while everyone thought the relationship was with the Sinaloa Cartel, that López Obrador was indeed with the Sinaloa Cartel, yes, but Mencho's cartel continued to grow and expand
because they were given that opportunity. The governors, José Luis, that's where the key lies. All the governors who came in with Morena have allowed the channels to be opened for the entry of the Jalisco New Generation cartel. That's incomprehensible. López Obrador said it from his maxim that these words should be nailed to the walls, of course, of Congress in gold, in gold, [laughs] hell yeah , in gold, that it says that there is not a single juicy business that is done under the protection of power without the approval of the
president. So, José Luis, no one from the Jalisco cartel is going to fall, at least not during Claudia Sheinbaum's six-year term. If he falls, it will probably be because the US government scored a goal on him, like the goal they scored when they went after El Mencho, which we've talked about a lot. El Mencho was located; it was the fifth time the US government located El Mencho for his capture, and the first four times they gave the version to Harfush and the president, and all they did was tell him, "Get
out of there because they've already found you." And the man escaped. The fifth time, the United States said, "No way am I giving any participation to that corrupt Claudia, or to that idiot Harfush." Oh well. There he goes. Yes, Harfish was sent to the idiot's place so they would warn Mencho, and that's why the capture happened, except for the possibility of forces arriving—that's a key point, José Luis—that American forces would arrive , infiltrate, and enter without official authorization, of course, without knowledge, of course, and go to capture or eliminate these
groups. This group is how there could be casualties, because remember, and I think it's important that we mention this, José Luis, that in a declassified file from the American army, it was revealed that there were virtual operations, there were exercises simulating entry to capture narco-terrorist groups. This was two days later, right? Six, five and seven days after the first ones we already know were declared narco-terrorist groups . But there have already been exercises by the US Army.
Yes, there were military exercises, José Luis, one day after the narco-terrorist groups were
declared and there was an exercise simulating their capture. Do you think they didn't continue? Do you think there are no exercises at this time? Of course there are . And hopefully, hopefully one day these exercises will be put into practice and that they will actually go after the drug traffickers who have the country, well, upside down, right? Damn, we have to say it like it is, right? They have the country screwed up and sunk in barbarity and misery.
Hey, and you were referring to these operations by the United States government,
but there are also many questions surrounding the killing of Rubeno Ceguera himself, right? Because, look, the operation that is done with intelligence from the United States, in which only the Ministry of National Defense is directly involved, but not the Ministry of Security, they don't inform the president and well, in the end they capture him in a very strange operation. There was an official silence for quite a few hours, and then they finally said, "No, well, what do you think, he died on us?
We took him down , we had to
fire and repel the fire. Well, the other one who ended up being killed in a confrontation with the army, one nicknamed Tuli, right? This Hugo César Ureña too, who was part of Mencho's inner circle . Well, in the end, these men , I mean the federal government itself, never gave us any reliable or verifiable information about what happened in that operation. There's a photograph of this man's body. The autopsy is practically all they wanted to show us, right?
I mean, the federal government itself . So, there's no clarification of these
events. There's no chronology either, they never showed us the map or the operational plan of action, of extraction, of containment. Well, I mean, if the government wanted to boast about that event and say, " We took him down." And we ended crime, well, that's how it was, was n't it? As the United States government also does at the time. Do you also remember Operation Black Swan, which they carried out to capture El Chapo Guzmán? Uh-huh. Clear.
And they showed it, saying, "No, well, the thirst entered through here and passed through
here in Mazatlán and continued here in Culiacán and all that crap and so on, but there was nothing here." I mean, I think that part of that post-truth, which you criticize a lot, is what has prevailed in this government of the fourth transformation. Exactly, José Luis, that's it, post-truth, which is what has prevailed in this regime that does it . Why haven't they come out? Hey, I was just remembering the operation where Barbas , Beltrán Leivar, was killed.
Beltrán Leiva, yes. Uh-huh . And you remember photographs, videos, the banknotes on
the body, I mean, all that stuff we saw at the time, well, it gave us a clear idea of how it was operational, right? DEA agents operating on Mexican soil carried out this operation, but today we don't know, and yet it was a large operation because there is talk of many casualties among the federal forces. So we are talking about an information gap that the government doesn't want to reveal to us. Why doesn't he want to let us know?
Because it's not in his best interest . And what is it
that is not good for him? It should be clear that the operation was carried out almost entirely by elements of the US government. What exactly happened? But anyway, I, José Luis, before we continue with the topic of the Jalisco cartel that we're talking about, uh, talking about how this week the murders of influencers have been very fashionable, of the influencers, of course, yes, the tokes, the youtubers, etc. My big question, starting from the basic principle that the Sinaloa Cartel, Los Mayos, or Los Chapos, have made great use of these characters
on social media, firstly to launder money, because these are accounts that receive deposits of 1,000, 3,000. Yes. And upon entering, of course, they are washing it perfectly, there's no problem at all. These are money laundering accounts . There was even a politician here, Fernández Noroña, who also receives extraordinary amounts of money, which I don't think is due to his high quality of information, but well, these are accounts that are used for money laundering. Point number two, TikTokers are used by drug trafficking groups because drug trafficking groups no longer have a
place in traditional media, they can no longer get into the media, into serious journalists. There is no one left to echo the message they want to spread. That's why they go with the TikTokers, because in their world of communicative ignorance, for them, a TikToker is the same as a journalist in the end . And that's why, because drug traffickers can no longer enter the formal information world and send their message, their positioning, or their policies to build support bases, at least emotional ones, for certain groups, they turned to TikTokers.
We
already know the story; many have been killed. The most recent one, César Castelum. Before Camilo Ochoa, you spoke, right? Yes, it was with Lucín, wasn't it? Yes of course. Yes, yes, with the Lucín. You spoke with Lucín days before he was murdered. There is also the death of Ga Toys or Gail Castro Cárdenas, Agustín Paul el Pinky, Leobardopuro Soto. Well, it's a long list. My question, José Luis, is the Jalisco New Generation cartel, so far the TikTokers linked to drug trafficking are only with the Sinaloa cartel.
I ask you, do
you think I have it? And here 's a question I'm asking you because you probably know more about the subject than I do. The Jalisco New Generation cartel does not have TikTokers at its service, it does not have influencers. Absolutely, absolutely. That question is relevant because we must also remember that part of the forced recruitment they carried out was through TikTok; that is, they would post a series of emoticons and say, "Hey, do you want to be head of security?" And they would put a man there, and they would put
two or three roosters there, and they would put a weapon there. In other words, there was recruitment by different accounts. Hey, whether it was public or not, like Marquitos Toys does from Spain, sending messages saying, "Oh, I miss my dear friend Néstor Isidro Pérez Salas, the NEET," and then he starts crying and showing off the watch he gave him. Hey, that's absolutely outrageous, is n't it? That's typical of someone who's delusional, that is, someone who simply wants to flaunt luxuries or believes they are part of organized crime, like Camil Ochoa
at one time, right?, whom I had the opportunity to interview. But I believe that in the case of the CJNG, yes, they are there, they are characters who have certain accounts and more, but they have not made themselves visible in the digital landscape. But they do exist. Just as there can still be a follower or adherent of, let's say, some nonsense perhaps, but of the tuta, for example, right? Or a fan of Rafa Caro's or Miguel Ángel Félix's, you know?
I mean, there must be some people out there who make
these kinds of posts on their Instagram. Or there are people, for example, that I've seen on social media who independently make corridos about some characters they call, well, saviors, the Robin Hoods of crime, and so on. In fact, there was a daughter of José Manuel Torres Félix, the one who was arrested many years ago, he was a lieutenant of Mayo Zambada. She had a TikTok account, didn't she? And she showed the way she lived and showed the partners she had and what she did for a living.
We see it the
same way with the daughters of blue, don't we? From Juan Josés Parraguosa Moreno, they are on Instagram. We saw it at some point with Ema Coronel. I mean, those who are in public are characters who want to be in that environment, that's very much the Sinaloa Cartel, but I feel that the Jalisco Cartel is there , but they are hidden and they do it purely for business, for recruitment and to launch messages of hatred or intimidation against their rivals or against the government itself.
And I think that's a point, a
very clear symptom of the stability of a cartel. Well, when you don't notice where the seams are, where Lilván's joints are, that's when you understand that things are going well in that group. And that's what's happening today, dear José Luis, I think that's what's happening within the Jalisco New Generation cartel. It is a thriving cartel, it is a financially healthy cartel, it is a healthy cartel in terms of stable relations with the Mexican government. It's a cartel that moves forward without much fanfare or social prejudice.
It is a cartel that
has managed to build its own base, its own social structure. Let's remember who has been out on the streets lately, José Luis, giving gifts at Christmas, on Three Kings' Day, on Mother's Day. Uh, the most important parties in Mexico are precisely the cells of the Jalisco New Generation cartel. And it is a cartel where there are indeed frictions and violence because they arrive, they are settling in. But once they settle in, José Luis, and I have to tell myself this, I really have to say it, there are entire entities that
come to experience the famous Paxnarca, right? Where they arrive, they settle down and stay put, and then it seems that there is no more violence, but it is precisely the domination of the cartel that came in. And we see this, for example, have you noticed that in Chiapas violence has decreased tremendously in recent years, what do you like, José Luis? 30 days in Chiapas, suddenly there were forced displacements, forced recruitment, shootouts, mass killings, people being expelled from their towns, from their own lands, and not even allowed to work.
Suddenly, 30
days ago, José Luis said, violence in Chiapas began to decrease. Violence, for example, in the northern area, in the mountain region of Puebla, has decreased. Violence, for example, has decreased in some regions of central Sonora. What is the reason for this? This is due precisely to the repositioning of the cells that were confronting those that were already there. They were either taken down or absorbed, but the dominance of the Jalisco New Generation cartel remains, and that is what has caused some regions to see a decrease in crime rates.
What José
Luis is announcing, what the mythomaniac lady from the executive secretariat of the national public security system, Doña Marcela, I don't remember her last name, Figueroa, is announcing. Doña Marcela Figueroa, the only thing she reflects when she says is that the index went down and homes in such and such a place reached so much and went down 70% in the municipality. The only thing those of us who know about this are letting us know is that someone says, "Ah, the cartel has really established itself .
The cartel that was in the
area was the Jalisco cartel fighting against the Sinaloa cartel, and now the Sinaloa cartel has really taken over. And that's what we're going to see. And look, that's what the Jalisco New Generation Cartel can offer, to summarize this issue, that's what the Jalisco New Generation Cartel can offer with this command structure it has now with Juan Carlos Valencia: a cartel that's going to leave patches of narco-peace throughout the country. Which is good. Look, peace comes from wherever it comes from, whether the United States comes and takes them away, whether a
UFO comes and abducts them, however it happens, but let there be peace. Yes, ultimately . And that's what we're going to see, José Luis, in the coming days we're going to see how there will be patches of what look like pacified zones, but not because of the presence of the army or the navy or the The reason for this is precisely because the Jalisco New Generation Cartel, in that reorganization, has already arrived, regrouped, infiltrated, and established itself in the area.
Extortion continues, of course, as do kidnappings and other types of
crimes, but homicides are not as prevalent. Because, curiously, have n't you noticed this statistic? Murders are down, but kidnappings are on the rise; homicides are down, obviously in relation to drug trafficking, but extortion is starting to increase . That is the clearest, or most obvious, way to understand that a region has been taken over by a drug cartel. And that is precisely what the Jalisco New Generation Cartel is doing today: establishing itself in the regions to impose its narco-peace.
And that is precisely what worries the U.S. government: the repositioning of
the Jalisco Cartel. And that is why the rewards are practically 100 million pesos, I mean, 100 million dollars. Rewards for some of the cartel's leaders... well, that sounds very tempting. It indicates, of course, that the United States has the Jalisco New Generation Cartel in its sights. Wow, that's what worries me, which is what we referred to in the book "The Fourth Transformation of Organized Crime," uh, Ricardo Rabelo and I, that, well, if with the PRI they were subordinate to the state—I'm referring to organized crime—with the PAN, partners and accomplices, but
now, look how you put it, right? The cartel, the cartel of the government, or how did you say it, the government of the cartel. The government of the Jalisco New Generation Cartel. That is to say, now it has subordinated the state itself to the rules of the drug traffickers. I find it disastrous, I find it unheard of. Hey, and you were referring to Chiapas? Chiapas, we said it, damn it, we said it here, that there was an agreement between The Jalisco New Generation Cartel and Los Chapitos ceded two important strongholds
to this four-letter cartel. One was Zacatecas and the other was Chiapas. And they are in Zacatecas. Well, it's an explosion of unprecedented violence, which is precisely what we're going to talk about . This territory is still in dispute with the Mayiza faction, with the Jalisco New Generation Cartel, but in Chiapas this group has already established itself and has managed to displace what was once under the command of Ismael "El Mayo" Zambada. So, it's not fortuitous, it 's not a coincidence that these kinds of realignments are taking place and that, in
a way, this organization, as you rightly point out , is appealing more to a narco-patron than to the administration of justice and security incentives from the Mexican state itself, right? That is to say, the monopoly on force is over, they no longer have it, the Jalisco Cartel has already taken it away, and now we find ourselves with these These are people for whom they're offering 25, 15, 10 million dollars. And I don't know if you noticed or made a comparison, but now the Chapos look like babes in arms, right?
Next
to Juan Carlos Valencia González himself. I think they were offering, what? I think 10 or 15 million for each of the Chapos, and now they've been relegated to last place, right? They started with five and went up to 10, and that's where the sons of Joaquín Guzmán got stuck. But anyway, to wrap things up, José Luis, I just wanted to mention that another reason why I think the Jalisco New Generation Cartel would be a major target for the U.S. government is because it has also become the main producer.
Yes, the
main producer of Fentanyl. We have to remember that before, the Sinaloa Cartel held the majority in production, but when they partnered with the Jalisco Cartel in the war against the In May, they had to pay them with laboratories and the formula for fentanyl production. And the Jalisco cartel is a criminal enterprise, but it is a business. And it dedicated itself to it. So it went from the 60 laboratories with which the Sinaloa cartel paid the Jalisco cartel for their support in the war, to creating a network, a true network of
laboratories, no longer just in the mountains of Badirahuato, or rather in the mountains where the Golden Triangle converges. Golden Triangle. Uh-huh. Exactly. Not just there anymore, my dear José Luis, we now have a chain of laboratories belonging to the Jalisco New Generation cartel that runs down from Nayarit, through the entire Sierra Madre Occidental, from Nayarit, Jalisco, Michoacán, Guerrero, and Oaxaca. So, we 're no longer talking about 60 laboratories, we're talking about an industrial quantity that will surely have to be quantified—how many laboratories and the production—in order to understand the level
of risk that the... Fentanyl production, and for that very reason, the Jalisco cartel has been classified as a terrorist organization, a narco-terrorist organization, and now they've added another layer. It's not just a narco-terrorist organization; it's the organization with the highest rewards for its leaders. So, that's like an added bonus on top of being a narco-terrorist. It's more like a narco-terrorist, José Luis. So, we're talking about an organization that worries the U.S. government. In Mexico, well, ah, Mexico is a mess, nothing ever happens in Mexico.
Yes, but it does worry the
U.S. government, and for that very reason, I think they're going to go after them soon. And well, the outcome is uncertain, José Luis. Because if they're interested in politically capturing one of these drug traffickers, we've seen that in 2027 there will be elections here in Mexico, and we can't doubt that they'll pull out their ace in the hole and say, "Oh, look, here was the snitch." Suddenly it crossed our path, suddenly the toad jumped out at us and we caught it here, right?
I mean, the government is unpredictable, and it's
also corrupt, manipulative, and complicit in these activities of organized crime. My dear Jesus. Hey, well I'll stick with this good description you give of the cartel as an organization, uh, as a criminal enterprise, a transnational drug company, a holding company, as you perfectly describe it, a company also categorized by nearshoring practices, bringing closer some of the incentives that the AMPA itself requires, right? to survive, from illegal drug trafficking, fuel smuggling, migrant trafficking, in short, all that range of atrocities that fall under organized crime.
I'm left with that, with the thorough
study we're conducting on the phenomenon of organized crime to understand what will happen with Juan Carlos Valencia González, and above all, to emphasize that he shouldn't be misled by a simple number, whether it's 25 million, 15 million, or 10 million. Behind that lies an even more detailed analysis, and sometimes there are coded messages that the United States government itself wants to send to the Mexican government, and also to make it abundantly clear that the federal government is failing to distance itself once and for all from this narco-government that it has
supported, and which, at the end of the day, it has now sustained, but is unsustainable. In the end, heads roll, in the end, the pieces collapse, and power is not eternal. My dear Jesus, that 's correct, Jose Luis, and I am very grateful for this opportunity you give me to be able to do this specific review of what is happening with the Jalisco Cartel, because it was urgent that we talk about the Jalisco Cartel. We're going to keep reviewing what else we can contribute to the knowledge of the criminal world
for our audience, which, as I always say and today we hardly flatter them, José Luis, the most intelligent audience of all social networks, it does n't matter if a few get involved and then start messing things up and shearing the sheep, right? As they say in my town, but it's okay, it's okay . The important thing is that even if they come in here, they take something away to keep chewing on later when they can. Thank you very much.
They should bring their own Tupperware. Let them bring their own Tupperware,
my dear Jesus, so we can give them food to take away [laughs] so we can give them food to take away, right? But anyway, dear José Luis, thank you very much. I really like this possibility and well, nothing, just to say that we're going, it's Friday, the weekend, Saturday, so we can read this text and we'll talk about it later and hey, let's see about scheduling the next time we'll talk about this, that's all . What do you think?
I propose this so that the audience is ready for the next
one, and that the next one will only be about discussing the book " The Day El Mencho Fell". What generosity, my dear Jesus. I am always grateful for your knowledge, for your friendship, for this complicity we have developed in the Narcomundo episodes, and well, having a space for the two of us where we can freely discuss our different perspectives on organized crime, based on our knowledge and investigations. I am truly always grateful to you. I would also like to thank the audience who always listens to us like parishioners, punctually every
week here on Narcomundo, on the channel of my dear Jesús Lemus and on mine . I started the introduction very strong, very fast, but it has to be said. Please subscribe to the channel, activate the bell to receive notifications of new videos, give us a like and also comment Total Freedom. And well, since we're already taking advantage of this commercial, look, I just found this one too [laughs] so you can give us a little help. Hey, you can find the book "The Day El Mencho Fell" in bookstores.
The prologue is
magnificent, the writing so meticulous, so painstaking, my dear Jesus, like filigree, you would say. Thank you so much for your support, thank you so much for your love, and well, we'll talk again next week in another episode of Narcomundo the podcast. I'm sending you a big hug, my Creous. Hug. See you later. See you later.